May 15

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Reading 1 - Deuteronomy  32
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v. 7 - Many verses in scripture emphasise the responsibility that we have to impart the knowledge of God to the next generation - and here we see that that responsibility is not just one of parents but also of those who are considered the elders. We all have the care of our young people to address effectively. Ps.44:1, Exo.13:14, Job 8:8-10, Ps.78:3,4.
Peter Cresswell [Derby Bass Street (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter
v.10 That Israel was the apple of God's eye is not in doubt. However we see that this description also is used of the law and as a lament as well as a warning. Psalm 17:8 Lamentations 2:18 Zechariah 2:8 See also Proverbs 7:2
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter
v.11 - We can be sure we are safe under the all encompassing safety of the wings of our God. His parenting is beyond our experience and always righteous. Let us remember that we always have his care for us, and so determine to give back our praise and thanks in all that we do. Exo.19:4, Isa.31:5, 40:31, 46:4, 63:9
Peter Cresswell [Derby Bass Street (UK)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Peter
32:2 'as the dew' is picked up and used of the blessings of Yahweh. (Deuteronomy 32:2 Psalm 133:3 Isaiah 26:19 Hosea 14:5)

32:7 At least one person took notice of what Moses said. (Psalm 143:5)


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Peter
SCRIPTURE IN SONG

It is interesting to see, as we read through the Bible, how many parts of scripture we instantly recognize as having learnt because we have heard them in song. It is not that we have purposely gone out to memorize parts of the word of God, yet because so much of it has been set to music, we remember what it says. It was for this reason, I believe, that Moses gave Israel this message in a song. God told him, "Now write down for yourselves this song and teach it to the Israelites and make them sing it, so that it may be a witness for me against them." (Deut 31 v 19). So Moses sung the song to all Israel. The music, the rhythm, the rhyme and the words all help us to remember it. And so this was a song that would have been remembered by the Israelites for a long time to come.

This particular song was much more than just a nice piece of music. It warned Israel of the choice they would make about serving God in the future. So Moses said, "Take to heart all the words that I have solemnly declared to you today ... they are not just idle words for you - they are your life."

The lesson is for us to do the same. Let's get the word of God into our minds and hearts by music or whatever means we can. Let's take it's message to heart and live by what we have learned.

Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Robert
v.3-4 - Note how often the names of Deity are used and the many variations or titles of God.
They appear in the following order:
"LORD" - Yahweh - v.3
"God" - Elohim - v.3 (sometimes applied to false "gods" - v.17)
"Rock" - Tsur - v.4 (sometimes applied to a false "rock" - v.31)
"God" - El - v.4
"Most High" - Elyon - v.8
"God" - Eloah - v.15
For all the significance and beauty of the Names there is this question to ponder; v.6 - "is not he thy father (Isa. 63:16, 64:8; Mal.1:6; IChron. 29:10) that bought thee?"
Surely the lesson of the "Rock" is for us as well as Israel.
Matt. 16:18 - "Upon this Rock (the Christ) I will build my Ecclesia"
Deut. 32:4 - "He (Yahweh) is the rock, His way is "perfect" - Cp. v.5 with Phil. 2:15
v.15 - "They lightly esteemed the Rock"
v. 18 - "of the Rock that begat thee thou art unmindful and hast forgotten God that formed thee."
Do we follow Israel's example?

David Pride [Cranston, Rhode Island (USA)]     Comment added in 2003      reply to David
32:15 'kicked' is quoted (1Sam 2:29) as is 'lightly esteemed' (1Sam 2:30) showing that these laws and the language of Deuteronomy  was not just for the wilderness. It had far reaching consequences for the nation.

Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Peter
V.52  Moses had been told (Num 27:12) that he would see the land , but, he was also told that he could not enter into it. This had to be a severe disappointment, but not a murmur of complaint comes from his lips.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to John

 

Vs.1-43 Song was used as a medium by the Israelites, mainly for praise.  The term song is certainly descriptive of the poetic domain, although the text was not necessarily set to music. 

Here, Moses has the nation learn a song as a memorial concerning obedience and disobedience.  It would serve as an indictment should the nation stray.  It will also serve as a remembrance in the Kingdom (Rev 15:3). 

Other notable songs were: Moses' praise for deliverance from Pharaoh (Exo 15); Moses and Israel at the provision of water (Num 21:16,17); the deliverance of Israel by Deborah and Barak (Judg 5:12); David when he was delivered from Saul (2Sam 22:1). 

Of course the Psalms, which were largely composed by David, were songs sung by a choir and accompanied by instruments.  The Song of Solomon, which we have just read, was a song of intimate, exotic poetry. Jesus and His disciples sang a song of praise (Matt 24:30); and the redeemed will sing a new song before Yahweh in the Kingdom (Rev 5:9; Rev 14:3).  We will now read Isaiah's song about Yahweh and His vineyard in Is.5.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Michael
This "Song of Moses" was to be taught to Israel.  Moses knew that poetry, or words set to music, is much easier to remember than straight prose.  He really did make a huge effort to encourage the people in God's ways.
David Simpson [Birmingham Kings Norton (UK)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to David

32:11     The analogy of God caring for His people in the same way that an eagle teaches her young to fly is most appropriate as a way to describe God’s care for His people.  The eagle pushes the young out of the nest to teach them to fly – flying under them to prevent them from falling to the ground. So when the young is flying by itself no help is given but when the bird begins to fall the parent flies underneath to support it.  So the bird learns what it can do and cannot do and so gains confidence. Of course it has implicit trust in its parent. God ‘proves’ His children but does not leave them to their fate unaided. John 6:6 etc:


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to Peter
V.2,3,4,43 - God's teachings fall like rain, the living water/word of life (John 4:9,10,11,12,13,14,15,25,26) is available for Jew and Gentile.
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to Charles

32:4-5 Notice the contrast. God is ‘just and holy’ the people were ‘perverse and crooked’. God will dwell with the humble and contrite – Isa 66:2 – Israel’s behaviour jeopardised their fellowship with their God. What about us?


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Peter
FEEDING ON GOD'S WORD
 
When Jesus was tempted to make stones into bread, he replied, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.'" (Matt 4:4) Jesus knew and put into practice the fact that God's word is the key to living life - so much so that he considered feeding on God's word more important than eating food.
 
Moses said a similar thing when he said to Israel, "Take to heart all the words I have solemnly declared to you this day, so that you may command your children to obey carefully all the words of this law. They are not just idle words for you - they are your life. By them you will live long in the land you are crossing the Jordan to possess." (Deut 32:46-47)
 
Both Moses and Jesus tell us that feeding on God's word extends our life. The Bible is not just a book like any other book we have on our bookshelves. It is the living word of God. When God's word is inside us it becomes our life - life now and for ever more - without God we have no life.
 
Let us follow the teachings of Moses and Jesus, and live our lives by regularly feeding on God's word and letting it mould our characters. God's word needs to become our life.

Robert Prins [Auckland - Pakuranga - (NZ)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Robert

32:1   The call to the earth and heavens to ‘hear’ is spoken of by Isaiah – 1:2 – to God’s people to remind them that they had fallen far short of their high calling as Moses lays out here.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Peter

 

Vs.50-52 Moses, like his brother Aaron, was not permitted to enter the Promised land because of his unfaithfulness at the waters of Meribah (Num 20:11,12). He was allowed to see the land and to contemplate what he would miss before he died. This portends what will happen to the adversaries of Jesus. They will have a glimpse of the Kingdom before they are rejected and die (Luke 13:28).


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Michael

32:4  The way that God is described as ‘just and right’ is ascribed to Jesus – Rev 15:3– in a context of judgement.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Peter

 

V.10 The expression apple of his eye signifies someone or something favoured. Today we use it in our language more in reference to people than to things. The term apple, as in the fruit, is not applicable though.   Ps. 17:8 and Prov. 7:2 also use the word ishon which means pupil (of the eye); Lam. 2:18 uses bat which means daughter (of Zion); Zec. 2:8 uses baba which could also signify pupil. The idea of using the idea of pupil is that it is always central to one's observation (focus of attention) whichever way one turns. (See my note for Ps.17 on Jan 7 for further explanation).


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Michael

 

V.7 History has its place in teaching a current generation. For us, the events in the whole Bible (OT and NT) are there to teach us (Rom 15:4).

V.8 After the flood there was a new beginning on earth.  The sons of Noah: Shem, Ham, and Japheth became the fathers of people from three broad regions (See Gen 10:1,5; Acts 17:26):

-Shem means name, and it is from Shem comes the term Semitic, which includes Jews and Arabs.  Apart from the chosen people Israel and its Arab cousins, Shem also covers those in Asia.

-Ham means black in Arabic, and it is from Ham that the people of Africa hailed.

-Japheth means fair, and it is from him that Europeans derived.  

V.15 The name Jeshurun (Heb. yashar) means righteous people which is the ideal objective for Israel’s character.

V.49 Abarim was the mountain range which contained notably the Mts. Nebo, Pisgah, and Peor.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Michael
Deut 32:21;Rom 10:19Deut 32:35;Rom 12:19.   Deut 32:35-36; Heb 10:30.   Deut 32:43;Rom 15:10.
Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Charles

32:2 The concept of the blessings of God being like showers and rain upon grass is developed – Psa 72:6 – to speak of Messiah


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2010      reply to Peter
Reading 2 - Isaiah 5
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v.1-7 - The fate that is clearly set out here for Israel as a result of their turning to their own things is lesson enough, but the vine, into which we can be grafted, gives us so many lessons throughout scripture. Jesus picks it up too.
Peter Cresswell [Derby Bass Street (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter
v.6 The 'vineyard' was finally 'laid waste' when the Romans burnt the city and banned the Jews from living there in the first century AD. Jesus [Matthew 21:33] used this area in Isaiah to confront the Jewish leaders with their behaviour.
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter
v.16 - There is little we can do that is of greater eternal consequence than to magnify the Lord of Hosts. It is through the continual praise of His name that we find ourselves humbled and able to reognise the magnitude of his grace and mercy by which we are called to the offer of salvavtion thought the atonement which Jesus brought about. There is so much love showered upon us in this that we need to respond in praise. 1Chron.29:11, Psa.9:16, 21:13, 46:10, Isa.12:4, Rev.19:1-5
Peter Cresswell [Derby Bass Street (UK)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Peter

As already indicated (Chapter 1) Psalm 80 is appealed to when speaking of the vineyard. Actually there are a number of echoes both from the earlier books of the Bible and in later books from this chapter.

5:1 song Song of Solomon 1:1
5:1 well beloved Luke 20:13 etc:
5:1 hath a vineyard Song of Solomon 8:11 Luke 20:9 etc
5:2 He fenced … therein Matthew 21:33 etc:
5:5 Break down the wall thereof Psalm 80:12
5:5 Trodden down Luke 21:24
5:6 Lay it waste Psalm 80:17
5:6 briers and thorns Hebrews 6:8

Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Peter
:10 An Homer is ten times as big as an Ephah (Ezekiel 45:11). One expects a small amount of seed to produce a large harvest - the reverse that Isaiah speaks of is an indication of God's judgements as prophesied in Deuteronomy 28 / Leviticus 26.
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2003      reply to Peter
V.25  This is the first of five times that this refrain is used by the prophet. ( 9:12; 17; 21:--10:4) We all know and appreciate the effectiveness of something that is repeated. There are still heavier judgements which are coming. Lev 26, Deut 28
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to John
5:1 We have seen the way that this parable is developed by Jesus to speak of the way that God would destroy the temple because of the ineffective husbandry  of the leaders in his day. However this parable draws on the first unfaithful husbandman - Adam- by quoting the word 'planted' from Gen 2:8
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Peter

 

Israel was not a good steward in the vineyard of Yahweh, and so it was taken away vigorously.  We are working in Yahweh's vineyard at the present time.  How is our stewardship?  The parable of the talents (Matt 25:14-30) is worth reviewing. 


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Michael
V.26-30 This drastically severe form of chastening by the Lord upon His sinning people is graphically portrayed to show its horror and thus serve as a stern warning and deterrent.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2005      reply to John
Israel was a vine imported from Egypt (Isa 5:1-7). But instead of grapes it produced briers and thorns (Isa 5:6).  Briers and thorns were part of the punishment on Adam. The curse of Eden sadly triumphed over the good fruit God’s vine could, and should, have produced.
David Simpson [Birmingham Kings Norton (UK)]     Comment added in 2005      reply to David

5:25  Here we have the beginning of a recurring phrase in Isaiah. ‘For all that his anger is not turned away, but his hand is outstretched still’. Marking, over and over again that whilst God will not tolerate Israel’s sinfulness He is till willing to recover them if they repent.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to Peter

V.4 Everything possible has been provided and done for the salvation of God's people. The comparison is made by the prophet, of a keeper of a vineyard who does everything possible in the vineyard to produce good fruit, but his harvest is wild fruit. What a disappointment at the time of the harvest.


John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to John

V.13,26 - this prophesies God's people going into exile and the use of Babylon and Rome as punishing agents by God. Approximately 150 years after this writing Nebuchadnezzar sacked Jerusalem in 587 BC. Later, in 73 AD, Rome sacked Jerusalem.

 


Charles Link, Jr. [Moorestown, (NJ, USA)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to Charles

5:2God ‘planted’ Israel in the same way in which He ‘planted’ a garden – Gen 2:8. God is the gardener. We are His plants.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Peter

 

V.8 The restoration of property in the year of jubilee was not respected (Lev 25:13).  Greed for gain had overtaken many to the detriment of justice (Mic 2:2).


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Michael

 

Vs.1-7 Compare with Jesus' parable of the vineyard (Mark 12:1-11). Israel was not a good steward of Yahweh's vineyard in Isaiah's day. Therefore, He took away its hedge (His protection) and allowed the Babylonians to destroy the vineyard. The same disregard was shown by Israel in Christ's time. Yahweh took away the hedge and allowed the Romans to destroy the vineyard.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Michael

5:3 In describing Israel as a barren vine the prophet is saying Israel are as useless to God as they were in the wilderness – Deut 32:32


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Peter

5:5 The ‘song’ of the first few verses of this chapter speak of the destruction of Jerusalem - |Jesus explains that this is what it is speaking about in Luke 20:9. The phrase ‘trodden down’ in this verse is part of the basis for Jesus’ words in Luke 21:24


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Peter

 

V.10 The word acres comes from the Hebrew word tsemed which means yoke.  One acre (tsemed) is the amount of land a pair of oxen could plough in one day. The land covered by ten days of ploughing would yield only one bath (7.5 gallons- 33.75 liters) of wine.  And a homer of seed would yield only an ephah of produce.  This is not much when an ephah is one tenth of a homer.  It is like paying $10 to get back $1. Incidentally, the ephah and bath are both pegged at one tenth of a homer (Eze 45:11).


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Michael

5:5 The language ‘break down’ to describe what would happen to the ‘vine’ – which is Israel – picks up on the Psa 80:12 – where the Psalmist has already spoken of how God will treat his ‘vine (80:8).


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2010      reply to Peter

5:5 The language ‘break down’ to describe what would happen to the ‘vine’ – which is Israel – picks up on the Psalm –80:12– where the Psalmist has already spoken of how God will treat his ‘vine (80:8).


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2010      reply to Peter
Reading 3 - Colossians  2
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v. 3,4 - Here we have the basis for authority for truth. ONLY within the words of God and his Son can we look. v.4 makes it quite plain that man's enticing and beguiling words are to be shunned, but also warns us of their existence. Let us therefore take the lesson to heart and listen only to those things which are from God, discerning the carefully. ch.3:16, 2Tim.3:15-17, Eph.3:9, Rev.2:17
Peter Cresswell [Derby Bass Street (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter
v.11 'without hand' draws on the 'stone' of Daniel [Daniel 2:34,45 8:25] and Jesus' own use of the phase. [Mark 14:58] Further the phrase 'not made with hands' is used to speak of the ecclesia [2 Corinthians 5:1 Hebrews 9:11]
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2001      reply to Peter

Here is the list of links with Ephesians. We should consider how the needs of the two ecclesias are similar and why.

Language used in both Colossians and Ephesians
Redemption through his blood
Ephesians 1:7
made peace
Ephesians 2:15
present you ... holy
Ephesians 5:27
mystery ... hid
Ephesians 3:9
dead in sin
Ephesians 2:1
knit together
Ephesians 4:16
fornication ...
Ephesians 5:3
put off ...
Ephesians 4:22
put on ...
Ephesians 4:24
psalms ... to the Lord
Ephesians 5:19
wives submit
Ephesians 5:22
husbands love
Ephesians 5:25
children obey
Ephesians 6:1
fathers provoke
Ephesians 6:4
servants obey
Ephesians 6:5
masters
Ephesians 6:9

Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2002      reply to Peter
:12 Notice the use of Romans 6:4 'buried with him in baptism' an indication that Romans was available to the brethren at Colosse. I suggest that Romans became a manual of doctrine and practice in the first century.
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2003      reply to Peter

Here are a few more quotations to add to Bro. Peter's list above:

Colossians
Ephesians
Thankfulness for the ecclesia
1:16
Prayers for the Brethren & Sisters
1:16
Knowledge of their faith
1:15
The hope of their calling in Christ
1:17-18
Prayer for the believers
1:16
Strenghened in the inner man
3:16
The hope of their inheritance
1:18
Pre-eminence of Christ
1:21
Reconciliation by God in Christ
1:6-7
Maturity
4:13

John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2003      reply to John

Col 2:6-7.These two verses sum up the message of the letter. The emphasis is on Christ. To accept the truths relating to Jesus meant that they had to live in Him. Christ said “I am the way, the truth, and the life” To serve God acceptably involved following the way that Christ opened up. They must be moving with Christ and also be occupied in Him. Paul uses the example of a root of a plant or tree. The figure of roots brings out the idea that a believer’s spiritual life is a living organism which requires nourishment. The health, the very life of a plant depends upon its roots. In the parable of the sower, Christ makes mention of those who had no roots only endured for a short time. We all must take root in the soil provided by the Lord Jesus Christ.

Col 2:11.The Greek word 554 “Apekduomai”  is only used in this letter,
      2:11.  Off
      2:15.  Spoiled
      3:9.    Put off
They are all related, and are concerned with the same fundamental thing, that is the crucifixion of the flesh. Christ possessed a body of flesh and blood, He was exposed to the same temptations as each one of us. Yet He did no sin. Each one of passages brings out the association of the believer with Christ.

Col 2:21. It appears that these rules in the original Greek would have been in reverse order than they appear in the A.V. It is worth noting that “handle” is a much stronger word than “touch”. Handle has a meaning of “have nothing to do with” while touch is just what it says.


John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2003      reply to John
2:2 The way that the hearts of the brethren were to be 'knit together' is reminiscent of the relationship between David and Jonathan 1Sam 18:1 - remember Jonathan, the heir apparent naturally speaking was willing to give up his position to David.
Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Peter

 

V.18  The forbidden practice of worshipping angels is carried on today by some, in a similar fashion, in worshipping so-called patron saints.

V.20  We should be careful not to allow (or impose) the principles of this world to dictate our behavior as members of Christ's body.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2004      reply to Michael

2:1  The ‘conflict’ that Paul had to the Colossian brethren and sisters was ‘care’ as can be seen from the marginal rendering of the word translated ‘conflict’


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2006      reply to Peter

2:16 We might think that reverting to the law was simply a matter of observing the details of the Law of Moses. Indeed it is. Paul, however, makes a most interesting comments saying they are ‘a shadow of things to come’. We know that there is to be a reinstitution of elements of the law of Moses in the kingdom. However it seems that Paul is saying that these things should not be observed now because they are a shadow of a future time.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Peter

It’s interesting to note that the word “fullness” is from the same root as “complete” in Col 2:9,10. In other words, this is the answer of Jesus’ prayer in John 17:23 God is in Jesus, and Jesus is in us. God is in Jesus, and Jesus is in us.

 


David Simpson [Birmingham Kings Norton (UK)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to David
2:7 The figure of roots serves to bring out the idea that a believer's spiritual experience is a living organism which requires nourishment. The health, the very life of a plant depends upon its roots. In the parable of the sower (Luke 8:4-15), Christ makes mention of those who had no roots only endured for a short time.
John Wilson [Toronto West (Can)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to John

 

Paul was warning the Colossians about allowing foreign practices to be absorbed into the workings of the Truth.  Jewish legalism (e.g. circumcision); Hellenistic philosophy (e.g. the worshipping of angels); and Oriental mysticism (e.g. the worshipping of stars) were the main culprits.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2007      reply to Michael

2:13     The idea of being ‘dead in sin’ is a repeated New Testament theme. Consider Eph 2:1,13


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Peter

2:13    The idea of being ‘dead in sin’ is a repeated New Testament theme. Consider Eph 2:1,13


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Peter

 

V.9 Jesus had the spirit of God without measure (John 3:34). He had the same mind and purpose of God (John 10:30). He recognized, though, that His Father was greater than He (John 10:29;14:28). It is clear then, although Jesus was a specially empowered human being, He was not God.


Michael Parry [Montreal (Can)]     Comment added in 2008      reply to Michael

2:7 Paul mixes two different ideas here. ‘Rooted’ is from the plant life sort of description whilst ‘built up’ speaks of the completion of a building. Of course both metaphors are true f the growth of a believer. Paul is bringing together both elements into a description of spiritual development in Christ.


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2009      reply to Peter

2:19  In speaking of the way that the believers should unite with Jesus saying ‘knit together’ Paul is returning to what he said in 2:2


Peter Forbes [Glenfield (UK)]     Comment added in 2010      reply to Peter